Political Instability in Canada:

[Terrordar]

I can't go too far into detail, but now is a very unstable time in Canada. The western Albertans now are furious. The Bloc (Quebec seperatists) are in a position of power, and the government, only a few weeks after being elected, will likely be toppled within only a weeks time.

www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2008/12/01/coalition-talks.html

Steven Harper, Prime Minister of Canada, presented an amazingly uneventful budget, which targeted his political rival's funding, and on top of that, had no real tie ins for the Financial Crisis Canada is in today, such as any kind of support for the backbone of the Eastern Province's economy.

In response, the 3 opposition parties, to save their public funding (As parties get most of their money from the public, not from private donations made by lobbyists, the only exception being Mr. Harper's party, the Torries), as well as remove Mr. Harper from trying to force a majority Government upon Canadians essentially by cutting his opponents funding, will be working together.

Stephan Dion.
Jack Layton.
And Guile Ducep (I may have spelt that wrong).

Have signed an agreement for them to take power if a confidence vote should occur.



The threat of this, is the government is backed largest by western Canada (particularly Alberta, which it holds ALL seats of the province), the level of outrage, particularly and mainly from Alberta, which hopes as a province for its own political, and social prowess to grow, is immersible from what I can discern at this point.

Albertans have largest wanted their place in the sun, and the ability to finally "Stick it" to the Easterners for some time, often siting the fact that the East has literally 3x the number of people of the West, rarely is met with good remarks in turn. I know many "Western Supremists" even in the area which I live, who regard the East, the foundation of the country even, as having little value until the west essentially becomes the dominant Political and social force in Canada.



The culture of this nation, is falling apart. The west despises the east. The east is fighting amongst itself between Francophone and Anglophones, and the economy is beginning to list southwards now that car manufacturers may start going under. And this boiling pot that has been Canada for the last 10 years, since the rise of Western economic power, is starting to spill.

My main hope is nothing sets this off to go hot. Its not likely, but you never know. If this largely western government falls, Alberta and many parts of British Columbia may see demonstrations, or worse.

[Elliot Kane]

Not good. Hope it works out, somehow.

[Gay Titan]

Wow, I have been so focused on the US elections, that I failed to notice our northern neighbors. Sounds seriously dreadful.

[Terrordar]

I'll be blunt, this is the most serious situation I've seen in Canadian politics since the referendum which was defeated for the separation of Quebec. The market has dropped 900 points in Canada in a single day now as well.

This does not look good, as things are unravelling quickly even as I type, with the Governor General (Standin for the Queen) is now rushing back to Canada to see about a dissolution of the Government, or to force it to be suspended for 1 month until something else can be worked out. But its already too far gone. Suspending it, is only suspending the inevitable.

This government. Will Fall.

[Terrordar]

www.cbc.ca/national/blog/video/rex_murphy/alll_politics_no_government.html

A great breakdown of how this happened.

[Elliot Kane]

Depressing reading...

[LaFille]

There wasn't really anything else to do than pressure this govt to back down by any available mean; what he came up with economy-wise these last few weeks was simply unacceptable. The outrage from the extreme conservatists there is nothing beside the outrage of the rest of the population towards the PM's moves.

We're getting sick and tired of all these elections... There's no good choice anywhere; but there are worse choices than others, and letting him run loose with this plan was one of these.

Bringing up the Dreaded Quebec Separatists in the discussion is just a way to try to divide the English Canada by fear to rally them to the Conservatists' base. Quebec is about third-half-separatist, half-federalist, but separation is not on the hot points on table in the current situation (doubt it will be in the next year or so) and before and above all Quebec is a generally center-left people. The people here voted Bloc in a significant part because they didn't want to vote Conservative nor Liberal and that except in one county or two voting NPD was giving power to Conservatives or Liberals.

From what I can see from here though, the "East Aglophones fighting with the East Anglophones" isn't as much as you seem to imply. Those jumping off their chairs when the Francophone question is brought up is more the richer, more powerful western neighbors these past years, as you can see on almost any news channel right now.

[Terrordar]

I agree, Albertans and British Columbians are becoming more and more of the ones who seem to be against the Francophones. Which is of course discouraging. But still, now western separatism is becoming an issue even. Its always been more divided than Quebec separatism, but its growing. Definitely.

[LaFille]

I have never heard of Western Separatism; on the contrary, it seemed to me that anything heading even remotely against National union was received almost as a treason. (Ironic, too, after Harper himself defining Quebec as a nation of its own... in theory at least.)

More seriously, that is one of the things that is expected to weaken the coalition's support in Ontario especially (that is aside from the liberal leader's ways in themselves), the idea that it's "sleeping with the enemy".

Now everything is closed until the end of January and I'm afraid that it will only serve the Conservative party once more; very frustrating and disgusting IMO.

[Lews]

Me and my friend from my CS:S clan were getting into a big discussion about this yesterday before we agreed to stop talking about it because we were going to get ourselves too worked up. Although on vent me and her talked about quite a lot more then this, this is basically what I posted on our forums later:

The problem is that no matter who's in charge, it will still be a politician in charge. All politicians are the same, and just abuse a corrupt system to get themselves written into the history books, as well as a nice big paycheck on the side for them and their business friends.

The problems facing the country, and in the bigger picture the world, will not go away no matter who's in charge, and so basically in Canada you've got all these people pointing fingers and yelling and trying to be the top man, but not actually worrying about the real issues such as the economy, poverty, education, etc.

Stupid politicians. We should just get rid of them all. Democracy is such a stupid system.

[Glance A'Lot]

Stupid politicians. We should just get rid of them all. Democracy is such a stupid system.

Good plan, Lews - now tell us the name of the enlightened individual you'd trust with the power...

(Lews is not an acceptable answer )


The point is, while democracy is a tedious process, it is still the only system in which you actually CAN get rid of people you don't like (at least without an armed conflict) - evolving better alternatives to vote for would be another approach...

[Elliot Kane]

Hence my 'Neo-Democracy' idea, yes.

The problem with setting the system up for 'enlightened dictatorship' is that the system needs to be in place before it can be put into place - a snag I have yet to find a work around for.

The main problem with Democracy as it stands is that politics is the only job in the world with no actual job requirements so that literally anyone can get in - and ultimately become the leader of their nation if they seem unthreatening enough to all the other idiots in their party.

This is why we get so many utter mediocrities in the top jobs around the world and why it is so rare to find a politician who has any actual idea of what they are doing. Genuine ability frightens and threatens the majority of politicians and parties, so it tends to get to the top only by accident.

[Terrordar]

You guys do realize that Canada is actually not very democratic at all, right?

We do have an elected dictatorship. The only time its NOT an elected dictatorship is when its a minority government. Which it is right now.

[Elliot Kane]

Hey, be happy! Right now Britain has an UNelected dictatorship... which I'd be in favour of if wasn't totally inept, incompetent and corrupt to the core, but sadly...

[Terrordar]

Its a post Blair Labor government, what do you expect?

[Elliot Kane]

...Pretty much what we've got, now that you mention it... ;D

[Glance A'Lot]

Well Elliot, better UNelected than UN-elected!

[Elliot Kane]

A point, Glance, I must admit ;D

[tempest1944]

Hmmmm...one thing I REALLY despise, is anything stereotypical. I don't give a flying f*** about the differences between the English and French people of this country. We're all Canadian...we're all in the 21st century...GET OVER IT is all I can say. Look at the EU...Britian, France, Germany...all working together; after two world wars, they're working towards a common goal. Can we do the same in our own country?

I do hope this political...mess, straightens itself out; 'cause I'm quite proud to be Canadian, thats why I joined the military.

[Terrordar]

I agree that French and English Canadians don't have many true differences.

The only problem is, of course, there are people in both English and French Canada who exploit differences for political gains, and increase tensions.