D&D class - need feedback

[SilvaShado]

I was looking around the internet for new classes to play and found a Class Construction Engine. Having an idea of what I wanted to do, I used the engine to create a class, but I'm not sure if it's balanced. So if anyone has any opinions, suggestions, criticisms, please feel free to post.

Magic Virtuoso:
www.geocities.com/silva_shado/magicvirtuoso.htm

[Elliot Kane]

Is there anything other than CHA blocking the level of spells they can use? And if not, is there anything stopping the MV from increasing their CHA as their levels increase?

If the absolute cap is on 4th level spells, it becomes more balanced, but the assumption seems to be any mastery skill will be used on damage/combat related spells primarily. I'm not sure what would happen if a MV decided to specialise in, say, Unseen Servant, for example.

At low levels it's significantly more powerful than a normal mage, and I'm not sure that ever actually changes if the player starts with a high CHA.

With most campaigns not going much above 5th level, I'd not see a lot of point in playing a normal mage with this thing around.

Also - can a MV gain school specialisation or use the Heighten feat to get even more bonuses?

While I like the point of the class, if I was offered that option as a player I'd think all my birthdays had come at once. I'm not sure that's ideal for a balanced class.

Sorry, Silva...

[SilvaShado]

No worries E. I didn't think this was balanced. I wanted to create a class that was limited to level 4 and exceled at it. But then came the question of what makes someone want to continue in this class. So I came up with the ideas of Heighten and Mastery.

To respond to what you said, the CHA score doesn't determine the level of spells they can learn. They just cannot go above level 4 spells. Their charisma could go higher, but that wouldn't allow them to learn higher level spells. It would only give them bonus spells per day depending upon their CHA bonus.

I, too, don't really know what Mastery would do on non-combat spells. I guess my focus was more on combat than non-combat. I'll have to look at that.

No, they can't gain a school specialization. That's just a wizard ability, right? The heighten ability is not a feat. They cannot choose to take it. It happens at certain levels.

So you think it's too powerful? What would you do to balance it? Add more restrictions or maybe not do Mastery so often... Maybe not allow Mastery as a choice instead of regular feats.

[Elliot Kane]

I honestly wouldn't. I know that sounds really harsh, but there are already all kinds of mages in the books and I'm not really sure what adding another one would add to your game.

In the past when I created classes I did so to fill a gap that the rules didn't cover (Like a proper Necromancer or Diabolist class) or to fulfill a special function, like my Paladin variants who are in service to their deities.

If I were to create a new spell casting class it would also involve a whole host of new spells and abilities. And I certainly wouldn't use a computer program to write it.

Sorry to be so discouraging, but I figured you'd prefer an honest opinion.

[SilvaShado]

Ah well. Thanks for your honest feedback Elliot. I really do appreciate it. I might tinker with it some more. Like making wisdom, intelligence and charisma required abilities to be this class. So you'd have to have Cha 14 and Wisdom 14 to cast 4th level spells... but that still doesn't seem to quite balance it. I know, they have to have 14 in all three abilities to even take this class. Hmm... I'll have to see what my game buddies think of it. After all, they'd be the ones playing with it. If they think its okay, then I could play it for our upcoming session.

[Elliot Kane]

I wish you luck, Silva

[SilvaShado]

Thanks E.

Finalizing the ability score requirements, I came up with:
"A Magic Virtuoso has to have a 14 in Charisma, Intelligence and Wisdom. Charisma determines how powerful a spell a Magic Virtuoso can cast, up to level 4 spells. Wisdom determines how many bonus spells they can cast per day. Intelligence determines how hard those spells are to resist. To cast a spell, they must have a charisma score of 10 + the spell’s level. A Magic Virtuoso gets bonus spells per day based on Wisdom. The Difficulty class of a saving throw against a Magic Virtuoso’s spell is 10 + the spell’s level + intelligence modifier. Like other spell-casting classes, the Magic Virtuoso benefits from high Dexterity and Constitution scores."

Then I also got rid of the option to take Mastery as a regular feat. So the MV is limited to 6 mastery choices, whether it be 2 supremely mastered spells or 6 mastered spells, or anything in between.

I'll be presenting this to the group on Tuesday. I'll let you know if they're crazy enough to let me try it.

[Elliot Kane]

Heh. Hope it goes well for you

[Hand-E-Food]

One thought: What is the point of the rule "Charisma determines how powerful a spell a Magic Virtuoso can cast, up to level 4 spells" when they have a minimum requirement of 14 Charisma?

[SilvaShado]

Hand-E-Food: Because it needed clarifying that Charisma does determine the level of spells a person can cast, but is limited to casting level 4 spells. The minimun requirement of 14 in all associated abilities was added later to balance it. It is repetitive, but it's there for clarification.

Elliot: My group let me play it. We all started at third level characters. It was cool that I could cast more powerful spells than the wizard in the group, but it sucked when we went up against the "boss" encounter of the night. The creatures had a spell resistance of 18. None of my spells could hit them. So I had to use my feeble fighting skills... I'll let you know how it progresses, whether my group regrets allowing me to be this class.

[Elliot Kane]

Cool, Silva

Be interested to hear more about how you do

[SilvaShado]

Well, another night has passed, and we've found ourselves in an area that hates magic users. *sigh* So any obvious casting of spells can get you locked up and fined. But, we did have a blast out in the forest killing monsters to protect the stupid magic-hating people.

So I guess the DM knew what he was doing allowing me to play this class. He's just balanced it out with restrictions. I'm fine with that, however frustrating it might be at times.

It was actually funny at some points because there's an elven wizard in the group and we had to keep each other in check about not casting spells in public. These people are also elf haters, so they got under his skin a lot. There was one point he almost cast prestidigitation on the barkeep for insulting him so much. I had to thwak him over the head, which left him a little dizzy since I happened to be a minotaur. ^_^

So far, it's been pretty fun. And we leveled up to 4 so now I've got to choose new spells. I'm trying to go for unusual ones or variants of the normal ones. I'm getting the book Unearthed Arcana soon. Hopefully it'll arrive before we play again. I've only found a few spells online that I like.

There's an interesting variant of Fireball (3rd level) that is a 4th level spell and it allows you to make several fireballs up to total die count that you can cast for a normal fireball. It does require more components, as you have more fireballs, but it could be a lot more versatile. I'm thinking about taking that as my 4th level spell. But I have to see what else might be more useful.

[SilvaShado]

So we've play-tested it a bit more and figured out how to balance it better. I knew it was too powerful, just didn't know how to fix it without ruining the concept. I slowed down the magic progression - new spell levels are every 3 levels and fewer spells will be known for each level. I also spread out the masteries. I haven't had a chance to test it out, but everyone agrees that this is much better balanced. If it doesn't work out, Will suggested I try making it a Prestige Class. we'll see...

www.geocities.com/silva_shado/magicvirtuoso2.htm