Our First Banning

[Elliot Kane]

I can honestly say that this is one topic I hoped never to start, and truly never wanted to. I'm just sad it ever had to come to this.

Nights is banned.

I owe all of you an apology. I feel like this is a failure by me, and not least that I should have seen the problem a whole lot sooner than I did.

It became clear in my RPG that Nights had no problem at all in working to undermine and alienate those players he did not like in an attempt to drive them out of the game. What I failed to appreciate as soon as I should have done was that this was part of a wider pattern of behaviour, and that he was also doing it to people he didn't like in the Cascade as a whole.

I feel like I have failed all of you by not picking it up sooner, and I absolutely apologise to those of you who have been hurt by this whole mess.

If I had spotted it sooner, I might have been able to deal with it better; but I didn't.

A few days ago, I asked him to leave the RPG. He responded by deleting his account and leaving the site. At that time, I was unsure if I had done the right thing, but I felt I had no choice. His behaviour since then - which I will not go into - has convinced me I was absolutely right, and also that I had overlooked just how manipulative he could be.

It was only then that I started to look at his behaviour on the rest of the site, and realised what I was looking at.

It was obvious at that point that he could not return under any circumstances.

I was slow, I was stupid, and a lot of people got hurt who should never have been.

I am truly sorry.

Anyone looking for me to name names will be wasting their time. I am not going to drag anyone else into this mess - it's bad enough already.

Please don't bother pleading for Nights, either. My decision is absolutely irrevocable at this point, and will not be changed.

As you all know, I believe in keeping my board-related decisions as transparent as possible so that you all know what I am doing and why. I feel that this kind of thing should be explained as it's the worst kind of decision I have to make, and negatively impacts everybody.

I will not tolerate any 'hooray he's gone' type comments, and I expect the usual degree of civility towards other boardies in this thread. Beyond that, feel free to tell me how stupid I am and how much you disagree with my decision. It's not like I'm not expecting it.

Once again, I am truly sorry.

EK

[Gray Lensman]

I am no happier about the decision, I must admit. Sadly, it has become an unfortunate necessity.

Add mine to the list of apologies on this matter. I am sorry to everyone that it has come to this. I did not see this until it was much too late. I am especially sorry to the people who have been hurt because of what happened. I let you down. I will do my best not to do so again in the future.

I accept responsibility for imposing the final ban, which I did with Elliot's support. I had some doubts when Nights was initially removed from the game. I hoped he would prove Elliot wrong and accept responsibility for what he'd done. However, the longer it went on, all I saw was a continued pattern of the same behavior that got him kicked out of the game. I tried my best to find another way to resolve this, but he would allow us none. I am deeply disappointed in him, and wish he hadn't forced us to this.

I never wished to ban anyone for any reason. I wish we could have gone on longer without reaching this point. However, circumstances have brought us to this point against my best efforts to prevent it. I wish this decision had never become necessary.

I cannot go into any further details about this matter. To do so would harm certain people that have suffered enough already. Kindly do not ask me about the details surrounding this incident, either publicly or in private. I cannot divulge anything that has been said to me about this. This entire incident is distasteful to me as it is.

I am sorry this had to happen. My hope is that everyone can understand this decision, even if you may not necessarily agree with it. It was not one we made lightly, you may be assured. I will think less of no one for disagreeing. I ask only that you do so respectfully.

I honestly hope this is our last such incident. Thank you for understanding.

Steve

[Glance A'Lot]

noted - and I trust you two to have adequately and fairly considered the issues leading to your decision.

[Alrik]

I didn't know about that, because i don't read often here. Also, I don't read in your RPG, because i don't want to feel myself involved. I just leave it up to you, just plain this.

So, I don't really know what he was doing. I'm innocent, in that respect.

But I'm sure you did what had to be done, no matter how sad it might be.

[Misty]

Recent behavior, Steve and Elliot? I don’t understand this part. Nights haven’t done anything on the boards or chat since Wednesday when he left since he was kicked from the RPG. I took it upon myself to figure out the truth behind the matter and try to see Elliot and Steve view on the matter but everything kept gong around in circles. Finally Elliot said that he would give everything more thought about the matter and that if the others players to want Nights back that may sway him some.

So I talked with the players with players and Nights asked them what he needed to be more acceptable and less offensive so things wouldn’t get this bad again. Thursday night I left Elliot alone and focus on seeing what the players want and since Nights was trying to make effort to change would people help him with this. Friday I get a PM saying that Elliot finally answered was no way was he was ever going to change his mind.

I found Elliot response to very narrow-minded and unable to accept the fact Nights was apologetic and wanted a second chance. Nights seeing that he couldn’t do anything else to prove himself dropped the issue and went off to do his own thing. I still thought Elliot was doing an injustice and taking things to personally. Last night after talking to some people in chat I convince him not to abandon the friends he made here over some hurt feelings. Despite what is being currently said Elliot and Steve both said he was welcome in the forum and chat always and not personal or that he was a bad guy.

So Nights signed back up and five minutes later I am ban and asked what was the deal. Steve explained a much as he would to me and said it wasn’t for me, he seemed to have forgotten we share the same comp so our ISP would be the same. Then I was told Nights was no longer welcome here and that I would have to talk to Elliot about it. I was also told not to make more trouble or things would get much worse…

So I PM Elliot, who didn’t respond to me. I PM him twice more after he puts this up, which by the way violates his own banning protocol. Then I read Steve’s post, which basically tells you to not ask any question. If they didn’t want people asking question they wouldn’t have posted it like they did.

If we were going to get rid of everyone who offends everyone on the board this board would only be Shan. Because the only really thing Nights did was offending apparently the wrong people.

[Alrik]

Banning Shan ? Why ?

[Misty]

Re-read it Alrik she would be the only one left here if we ban people for being a pain in the ass.

[BJC]

Misty, I think Steve meant not to ask them for personal questions regarding the situation as it isn't there place.

Glance- right. It's all about what's best for the board.

[Misty]

I think it was more ask me no questions and I will tell you no lies deal really BJC.

[BJC]

Can't say I agree with you...considering you really don't know what they would say to begin with.

[Glance A'Lot]

Re-read it Alrik she would be the only one left here if we ban people for being a pain in the ass.
With which you are saying - though possibly not meaning - that Alrik, and I also, as everyone else safe Shan for that matter, are a 'pain in the ass'. I understand you may be biased, but you're doing a number of people, the majority of whom have absolutely no connection to the issue at hand, injustice there, and while I'm not overly sensitive in that respect, THAT I could take offense of.

If we were going to get rid of everyone who offends everyone on the board
anyone who offends everyone on the board - should be banned, no question;
anyone who offends any one - should be individually considered on the circumstances;
anyone who offends any number on the board - well?

See the difference? Maybe you would re-consider your formulation?

I think it was more ask me no questions and I will tell you no lies deal really
I rather felt it read: A PM is a private message, and neither Steve nor Elliot are privy to discuss with 3rd parties the contents of a PM.

[Gray Lensman]

BJC is correct on this. It is not my place to reveal certain things that I know. This is also being done for the benefit of other people. If I can't answer something, I will say so.

If anyone wants to ask questions on the facts already known, that is fine. It's the rest that I have no intention of talking about.

Edit: Glance is likewise correct. PM's are considered private for a reason. I intend to honor that.

[ss]

See what happens when you play those dumb computer games..I told ya not to play them...they mess with your brains... ;D

[Misty]

I would not have said anything here, Steve, if I got an answer to any of my PMs. I know I am new here and shouldn't be getting invole but my family was involed.

I admit I am a pain in the ass and everyone else at one point in time is also a pain in the ass. It's human nature.

[Alrik]

days said:

Re-read it Alrik she would be the only one left here if we ban people for being a pain in the ass.

Me, too ?

[Misty]

Well since your being a pain now yes you to could be ban.

[Elliot Kane]

Personally, I would say the majority of the boardies here - including Glance and Alrik - are never a pain in any way. Certainly that has been my experience.

Glance - you are exactly right. I don't feel I have the right to share private messages, which are after all meant only for me. They are most definitely not a weapon to be held and used at my convenience.

[Alrik]

I'm a bit curious : was Misty's last reply ironicallly meant or not ? I mean - I have *huge* problems detecting irony in people's sayings. I know it. I admit it. I can't change it. Well - almost. I've trained, but only recently I fell into the trap again.

So, I'm unsure at that point.

[Misty]

I sorry Alrik. Scarcasm.

[Venom65437]

Well, what a fun little thread this is. I never played the RPG, but E said this was spilling into the Cascade as a whole. I personally had never seen this.