Planescape: Torment

[Alrik]

Someone at RPGWatch has just found this :

www.amazon.co.uk/Plane-Scape-Torment-PC-DVD/dp/B002TOKQIG/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&s=videogames&qid=1257500314&sr=1-8

In thought you might be interested in this find.

[mysterd]

DieHardGameFan has a look-back on PST.
They also discuss whether Planescape should stay dead, have a sequel, have a spin-off, or start over with a reboot.

[Elliot Kane]

The set up for a sequel is inbuilt. Grace's search through the Planes for Nameless. I think that could be freakin' awesome, though definitely a different kind of game.

I do think any of the characters would do well for a spin-off, though, considering how well developed they all are.

None of them are ever likely to be as good as the original, whatever they do, but the same is true of every other RPG. I see no reason not to create a new story for them. About the only character who probably should NOT be brought back is Nameless himself.

[SPS]

Planescape Torment in 5 seconds

[Gray Lensman]

Heh. A good summation of the game, SPS. Classic Spoony.

[mysterd]

Greg Kasavin (formerly of GameSpot reviewing fame; now working w/ 2K Games) looks at PST and talks about how it has influenced many of modern-day RPG's and how he think it's one of the best RPG's ever.

In a typical RPG, you might be asked by a character to retrieve an item, and tell that person "Yes, I'll do it" even if you as a player don't really know if you're going to do it or not -- probably you just want the quest logged in case you stumble upon it. You don't think about these types of interactions, and, as evidenced by the completely disposable text content for quests in games like World of Warcraft, they do little to build a meaningful connection between you, your character, or the gameworld. But in this same type of situation, Torment typically would give you at least two options: "Yes, I'll do it" (Truth) and "Yes, I'll do it" (Lie). And it would fully support these choices -- lying would affect your character's moral alignment, leading to other changes in gameplay. But even when it didn't really matter whether you told the truth or not, the game made you stop and think about what you were saying.

[Elliot Kane]

I think the problem with most CRPGs is simply that most game designers don't really know what an RPG is. So they make something that's about stat crunching, or fighting or levelling up and they think they have made an RPG. Easy enough to do when you look at an RPG rule book and read through it out of the context of sitting at a table full of experienced players whose primary focus is not how many dice to roll or who's got the biggest sword, but rather how effectively they can act out the role of their character.

The number crunching is the framework, it's not the game; not the essence of the game.

The people who created Torment understood what an RPG truly is and they got about as close to it as anyone ever has with a computer game. Maybe as close as it's possible TO get without VR. I think that's proven more than anything by the fact that Nameless' level, equipment, etc, don't really matter all that much to the game. He can be as tooled up and invincible as a demigod or as weak as water and he can still find his way to the end and to... victory?

There can't be more than 2-3 fights you HAVE to do in the whole game. Because it's a game about story and plot and character and 'what can change the nature of a man?'

Still unsurpassed after all these years...

[mysterd]

Apr 3, 2010 1:25:22 GMT Elliot Kane said:

I think the problem with most CRPGs is simply that most game designers don't really know what an RPG is. So they make something that's about stat crunching, or fighting or levelling up and they think they have made an RPG.

That's more like the framework of a ARPG - like Diablo, Titan Quest, Torchlight; hence why the "A" (for Action) comes first.

You make decisions (usually at level-up time) that more or less effect how the combat will play out.

Easy enough to do when you look at an RPG rule book and read through it out of the context of sitting at a table full of experienced players whose primary focus is not how many dice to roll or who's got the biggest sword, but rather how effectively they can act out the role of their character.

The number crunching is the framework, it's not the game; not the essence of the game.

The Witcher does this well, as well - as it really does hide the numbers to an extent more than many other RPG's do. It doesn't really say overdose you w/ weapons and armor and equipment, either - as the game cares more about your actions and its consequences w/ the gameworld and its inhabitants.

Mass Effect 2 is another game - hard to define what that is, as it feels like a Shooter/RPG now - in which the game focuses more on the combat and your decisions. There's a lack of equipment and showing stat numbers for your character. You can upgrade the equipment every now and then - there's more and more upgrading, as you go further along.

The people who created Torment understood what an RPG truly is and they got about as close to it as anyone ever has with a computer game. Maybe as close as it's possible TO get without VR. I think that's proven more than anything by the fact that Nameless' level, equipment, etc, don't really matter all that much to the game. He can be as tooled up and invincible as a demigod or as weak as water and he can still find his way to the end and to... victory?

Fallout 1 and 2 similar - as you can finish those games w/ pretty much talking your way through the game, if you keep pumping your Speechcraft skill up.

There can't be more than 2-3 fights you HAVE to do in the whole game. Because it's a game about story and plot and character and 'what can change the nature of a man?'

Still unsurpassed after all these years...

Deus Ex is a FPS/RPG, which oddly enough can be finished w/ only killing 3 main character in the entire game, if you play your cards right...